Virtual Memories Show 645:
Rachel Cockerell
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“I kept coming back to the notion that there’s no easy answers. I hope that the reader is changing their mind every few pages, because the book is about the search for a promised land, and it’s this question of a Jewish refuge that turns around and around over the decades.”
How did Russian Jews wind up migrating to Galveston, Texas in the early 1900s? How did the image of America as melting pot come into existence? How did a family memoir evolve into a forgotten history of Zionism? Find out during my conversation with Rachel Cockerell about her amazing new book, MELTING POINT: Family, Memory, and the Search for a Promised Land (FSG)! We talk about the tightrope walk of composing a history solely out of primary sources and why she eschewed the author’s voice for this book, her grudging acceptance of Robert Caro’s maxim to Turn Every Page, and how her perspective on Jewishness changed over the course of writing the book. We get into the once-titanic literary figure of Israel Zangwill and how he gave it up to find a homeland for the world’s Jews, how Zangwill invented the notion of the melting pot and whether he truly believed in assimilationism, the inspiration of George Saunders’ Lincoln in the Bardo on Melting Point, and how Rachel got over the notion that the past was just a lead-up to now. We also discuss her next book on Halley’s Comet and whether she’ll stick with her primary sources-mode in future books, how her family reacted to seeing their stories (& contradictions) on the page, how a 90-year-old distant relative stole the show, and a lot more. Give it a listen! And go read MELTING POINT!
“I’m only a Londoner because Israel Zangwill said to my great-grandfather, ‘You should get out of the Russian empire, and come to London; your future belongs to England and your daughters are destined to become English.'”
“Interviewing my father and his siblings and cousins, it felt like they had almost been waiting to tell someone about all of this.”
“I realized the early 20th century was more interesting, and funny, and weird, and ironic, and vivid, and relevant than the 21st century.”
Enjoy the conversation! Then check out the archives for more great episodes!
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About our Guest
Rachel Cockerell was born and raised in London, the sixth of seven children. She did her BA at the Courtauld Institute and her MA at City University. Melting Point is her first nonfiction book. Her research has taken her to Texas, Ohio, New York, Tel Aviv, and Jerusalem.
Follow Rachel on Instagram and Bluesky.
Credits: This episode’s music is Fella by Hal Mayforth, used with permission from the artist. The conversation was recorded at an undisclosed location in Prospect Park on a pair of Blue enCORE 200 microphones feeding into a Zoom PodTrak P4 digital recorder & interface. I recorded the intro and outro on a Heil PR-40 Dynamic Studio Recording Microphone feeding into a Zoom PodTrak P4. All processing and editing done in Adobe Audition CC. Nice photo of Rachel by Iona Wolff; double-selfie by me. It’s on my instagram.